Lead on Spirit of Truth,

Eugene

Since Christ has already satisfied the individual, they remain satisfied in all things. Philippians 4:11 “Not that I speak from want, for I have learned to be content in whatever circumstances I am.”

I realize this isn’t easy to talk about but its a huge problem. Few have the courage to say it or talk about it.

eugene

Yes, Paula, I am very much of aware of McLaren’s position there. I just meant that I have not read/heard of any affirmation / denial of Pagitt’s theology of sexuality as published the book in question. It would seem, thus, that McLaren’s position here would be very similar to Pagitt’s.

For reference, McLaren’s statement is fond here:

Perhaps we need a five-year moratorium on making pronouncements. In the meantime, we’ll practice prayerful Christian dialogue, listening respectfully, disagreeing agreeably. [...] Then in five years, if we have clarity, we’ll speak; if not, we’ll set another five years for ongoing reflection.

From Tyler’s quotes, as well as the Scriptural references I’ve posted, I think we have a sufficient evaluation to come to a conclusion about what God thinks about human sexuality. I do agree that all Christians and churches need to be diligent in caring for those in such sin with truth in love (Ephesians 4:15). Any failure here cannot be strictly put on the Reformed / conservatives alone but all of us Christians who have failed to love all people who are made in God’s image in spite of their sin.

Joe: I have left Bell out of this, and I’ve tried my best to stay on the issue as per Pagitt’s own words.

SDG

4.1 Don’t you know that adequate theological and moral categories will not exist in the Kingdom of God? 2Do not be deceived: neither the monogamous, nor teachings of God’s wrath, nor penal substitutionary atonement, nor kenosis, 3nor propositions, nor any hypostatic unions, nor propitiation, nor Calvinists nor Arminians shall inherit the kingdom of God. 4And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were cleansed of your former modernistic categories, and you were vindicated in the pooling of ignorance and the appreciation of mystery and absurdity.

5I marvel that you are so quickly being led astray by those who feign holiness on the surface, but underneath are miserable ascetics, 6who make audacious claims such as “not all things are expedient,” and “the body is not for sexual immorality, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.” 7Don’t you know that your sexuality and your free expression of it, however you desire, is not only your right as an image-bearer of humanity but an intrinsic part of who you are as a human being? 8Don’t you know that your bodies are members of the entire human race? Shall I then take the members of Humanity, and have them divided amongst themselves? May it never be! 9Flee restrictive sexual categories! Do you not know that your body belongs to yourself alone, and not to God? 10For you were purchased through your own power of self-determination; therefore express freely your own unique sexuality in your own body, which belongs to no one else.
(cf.1 Cor 5.9-13, John 7.24, 1 Cor 6.9-20, Gal 1.6)

Mclaren has declared a five year ‘moratorium’ on taking a stand against homosexuality while we ‘reevaluate.’ or something along those lines.

nc I think you must be living in a cave someplace if you don’t think Pagitt has a following. He’sa darling of the E Cov for one thing which while not a huge denomination, is not terribly tiny either. They are pushing every kind of popular heresy right now. Why do you suppose CNN called him up to do the thing on Yoga? Because he’s obscure?

Of all the people within the network of relationships called Emergent Village that I have been exposed to I’ve yet to hear a call for the “normalizing of homosexuality”. I HAVE heard a call to compassionately minister to homosexuals and to recognize that they are in our midst and need to be loved, cared for and discipled with gospel-filled relationships.

For the large readership and following that Pagitt doees have, this is off [sic]significant concern…

Then why not just deal with Pagitt and leave Bell out of it?

However, for the large readership and following that Pagitt does have, this is of significant concern for it is certainly deceiving in comparison to what God says about sex in Scripture.

Actually Pagitt is a latecomer to this vein of comment.

They brought the issue up again for discussion at the annual meeting in 2006.

The Evangelical Covenant (which is who Pagitt is affiliated with and they seem to adore the guy) is going downhill REALLY fast. Everything is coming in under the guise of ‘Christian liberty.’ No one knows doctrine anymore.

great point, just be careful you don’t paint with a broad brush.
One quote about a particular issue by a particular guy (even a “leader”) does not mean Emergent “pastors” would agree. Plus..there’s no such thing as an “emergent” pastor. There might be some pastors that have relationships within a network of people called “Emergent Village”, but my experience with them is that there is no where near a consensus with the specific views of people like Pagitt, McLaren, etc.

If we aren’t careful and circumspect with our words we will only perpetuate misunderstanding that undermines the mission of the Gospel.

Christ died, Christ is risen, Christ will come again!